Peter Self vs. Peter Smith Self

© Kathy Duncan, 2017

As I examine more and more of the records that I have available to me about “my” Peter Self of Benton County, Tennessee and Chatham County, North Carolina, I am becoming more and more convinced that Peter Self was not Peter Smith Self born 1 Feb 1786 in Northumberland County, Virginia. Admittedly, my search cannot be called exhaustive, but I think that an exhaustive search of records will eventually link my Peter Self to his family, whoever they were.

First, let’s examine their names. Peter Self never uses a middle name or middle initial in Benton County or Chatham County. This observation is based on the censuses for 1820, 1830, 1840, and 1850; a Chatham County tax list; the estate settlement of Giles Vick; a land deed in Benton County in which land is deeded from Peter Self Sr. to Peter Self Jr.; and a lawsuit in Benton County, filed after Peter Self’s death. His son Peter Self/Selph Jr. also seems not to have a middle name or initial although he names his own son Peter Nunn Selph. Smith also does not reappear as a middle name within the first few generations of Peter Self’s family.

The next possible way to link the two Peter Selfs would be by establishing that they have the same birth date. Peter Smith Self’s birth date or christening date is recorded as 1 Feb 1786 in Northumberland County, Virginia. That record also establishes that his parents were Moses and Nancy Self. My Peter Self is thought to be buried in the Ellis Cemetery in Benton County, Tennessee; however, there is no tombstone for him. No conclusions about Peter Self’s name or birthdate can be drawn from his tombstone. So far, it is not possible to link the two Peter Selfs together based on their birth dates.

The only record that we have that could be used to narrow down a birth date for Peter Self is the 1850 Benton County, Tennessee census. Based on that census his birth date would be c. 1785, which I think should be bracketed by at least a year on either side, 1784-1786 although experience with the census has taught me that birth dates can be off by several years.

To date, I’ve found no land deeds or estate settlements that would link Peter Self of Chatham County and Benton County to Moses Self or to another potential father. That leaves researching Moses Self to see what became of his son Peter Smith Self. My suspicion, based on my findings, is that Peter Smith Self probably did not survive infancy.

Some of the most detailed information about Moses Self comes from his Revolutionary War Pension file. In his pension application, written on 26 June 1820, Moses Self of Westmoreland County, Virginia, stated that his family consisted of “Himself aged about 60 years wife 53 years very sickly 3 children residing with him, 2 1 Boys 21 years old 2 girl 11 years old the other about 23 years old.”

Of these children, the 21 year old son would be Moses Self Jr. There are only a couple of reasons why the two was struck out and changed to a one. There is either a son who is deceased, or a son who is not “residing” in the home, or the person writing the deposition just made a mistake. None of the children are named in his pension file.

Also in Moses Self’s file is the information that he was drafted in Northumberland County, Virginia in 1780, so he is the same Moses Self whose son Peter Smith Self was born in Northumberland County in 1786.

On 26 August 1839, Nancy Self stated in her widow’s application for a pension, based on Moses Self’s service, that “she was married to the said Moses Self in the year 1785 but on what day or in what month she cannot recollect nor has she yet been able to find any record of her birth or marriage. That her husband the aforesaid Moses Self died on the 14^th day of March 1835.”

On 16 September 1839, Jemimah Woolard of Westmoreland Co., Virginia, gave the following deposition: “…I was well acquainted with Nancey Self who was Nancey Smith before her marriage with Moses Self, that A few days before her marriage she requested of me to wait on her as Bridesmaid which I did and went with her to Parson Gibbrom and saw the said Nancey and Moses lawfully married, I returned with and waited on them the balance of the day which was about the first of October 1785. I have lived a near neighbor to them ever since until the death of the said Moses Self which was near the middle of March 1835.”

William Wright of Westmoreland Co., Virginia swore on 23 November 1839 that “the law of Virginia has acknowledged the said Nancey Self to be the said Moses Selfs lawful widow by giving her one third of the said Moses Selfs property after his death.”

This last tidbit indicates that there should be a probate settlement for Moses Self. Moses Self’s estate sale was held on 10 December 1835. Among those making purchases were Moses Self Jr., his brother-in-law Daniel Hardwick, his mother Mrs. Self, and his sister Peggy Lusby is mentioned. A Peter Self is conspicuously absent. This sale may be found on pages 255-258 and pages 303 – 304 of Westmoreland County, Virginia Records & Inventories, vo. 17-18, 1835-1840, LDS film 34320. I have not yet found a settlement that awards a third of Moses Self's property to his widow Nancy.

Among Moses Self’s Revolutionary War pension documents is this one:  On 29 November 1839, Benedict Walker, of Westmoreland County, wrote that “I have seen Mrs. Nancy Self and she declares to me that no family register or her marriage or record of the baptisms of her children is to be found as she knows of on earth, she further states that she does not at this time remember that her children has been baptized or what she calls it christened.” To this statement, he felt compelled to add this postscript: “P.S. I am well acquainted with Mrs. Nancy Self and do consider her to be an unlearned poor ignorant woman.”

If you did the math with me, Peter Smith Self would have been born a bit “early.” Nancy (Smith) Self may have conveniently forgotten the exact date of her marriage.

The second document for Moses Self Sr. stems from a lawsuit brought long after his death. That lawsuit can be viewed here.

In 1873 this lawsuit between Thomas Scutt and wife vs. Moses Self et al had apparently been waging for several years since some documents date back to 1866. The crux of the suit was that Matthias Self had died intestate leaving eight children to whom his land descended. By the late 1860s all of Matthias’s children and grandchildren were deceased. This left the surviving heirs of Matthias’s siblings and his wife’s family to lay claim to the estate. What unfolds within the 71-page file is an extensive list of relatives.

From the file, it can be determined that Matthias had a full blood sister, name unknown, who married a Cookman and then a Tellis. Matthias had a half-brother named Moses who “died long ago.” Moses left a son named Moses Self, “now living in Richmond County.” Matthias had two additional half- brothers: Thomas Self, who married a Bancroft and then married a second time to Alice Short, and John Self.

 A deposition from 85 year old Elizabeth Harrison of Northumberland County, Virginia, was taken on 11 January 1866:

“Matthias Self left eight children—Betsy Hill, Nancy Cole and I think Billy Lane was next, then Bennie, who married Dozier, & Hannah Tessel-maybe she was older than Bennie, John Posey, Thomas Chinn (I believe he was older than John) & Fannie who was the youngest of them all. None of them ever married or had children except Bennie who married a Dozier and had one child named Joseph who lived to be a young man and died in 1862 without ever having been married. All Matthias Self’s children died before Joseph Dozier except Nancy & Fannie both of whom died last year. [Matthias Self] married a Cole, I think her name was Nancy. She had a brother named Billy Cole who was the father of Jeremiah Steven’s first wife.

Matthias Self had a sister, I am not certain whether she was an own sister of a half sister. She married a Cookman first, and had a son named Thomas Cookman, afterward she married a man named Tellis; she had no children that I know of by Tellis. Matthias Self had three half brothers that I know of, Thomas, John, & Moses. Thomas married a Beercroft and had four children-Alsey, Petty, Matty Y Blinker. All died single and without issue except Peggy who married Edward Richardson and left two children, the present Thomas Richardson and Margaret who married John Harrison and who is still living. Thomas Self was married a second time to my sister Alsey Short and had two children – one named Joseph (the other I think died when she was very little) who went away from this country but left one daughter the present and second wife of Jeremiah Stephens. Moses Self the half brother of Matthias Self married Nancy Smith, I think, and was the father of the present Moses Self of Richmond County. He had no other children that I know of. John Self the other half brother married Betsy Lewis and daughters Polly who is now living on the Telfland, Betsy who died young, and Hannah who moved away and was not married at the time. Also a son named John died young the same night that Betsy died for I set up with them at the time.”

A deposition from Albert Davis, age 54, Northumberland County, was taken on 13 August 1867:

“Did you know Nancy Self and her brothers & sisters?

I knew them all, but much better acquainted with, Misses Nancy, Fany & Terry Chin than I was with the older sisters. Knew Moses Self the father of the present Moses Self well – Moses Self left three children the present Moses, Susan & Peggy. Susan married David Hardwick, died leaving 3 children, Sarah, Ann, Aaron. Peggy married Lesly leaving one son Thomas Lesly & she then married Hiaxly had one child but died without issue. Sarah married Albert Davis. Ann married Richard Courtney leaving two children – named William and Arthur.”

Based on the settlement made in this lawsuit, it can be determined that the following were Matthias Self’s siblings and his siblings’ children:

1.       Mrs. Cookman full sister of Matthias Self

                 Ch.: Thomas Cookman

2.       Thomas Self, a half-brother,

                 Ch.: Peggy Self m. Thomas Richardson

                               Ch.: Thomas Richardson

                              Mary Richardson married Harrison

3.       Joseph Self, a half-brother

                Ch.: daughter married Jeremiah Stephens

4.       John Self, a half-brother

                 Ch.:       Polly Self

                                Hannah Self

5.       Moses Self, a half-brother

                Ch.:        Moses Self, Jr.

                               Susan Self m. David Hardwick

                                               Ch.:        Sarah Hardwick m. Albert Davis

                                                              Ann Hardwick m. Richard Courtney

                                                                              Ch.: William Courtney

                                                                             Arthur Courtney

                               Peggy Self m. Lusly or Lusby

                                               Ch.: Thomas Lusly or Lusby

Since the purpose of the depositions was to gather information on all the possible heirs of Matthias Self, Peter Smith Self should have been mentioned. If Peter Self of Benton County had also been Peter Smith Self, he would have been named in this record even though he was deceased because he had children who would have been heirs of Matthias Self. However, there is no Peter Self named as a child of Moses Self in the lawsuit. These leads me to believe that Peter Smith Self did not survive to adulthood.